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[Moogle Buddy]

who were the last Loyal to Western Army(I Mean who left and not retreat or switch sides)

Wouldn't that be Hideyori, as he was the "Rallying" cause for the West, whether he wanted to or not.

[Mitsurugi]

Well if the Uesugi switched then i would have made a right choice of being loyal to that clan. 

[yellow turban]

Wouldn't that be Hideyori, as he was the "Rallying" cause for the West, whether he wanted to or not.

well I made a mistake expreesing it (Less informed)
I wanted to ask who did not switch side at the battle of Sekigahara?

[Orochi_X]

Well even though the West had some very peace loving states, most of them had the littlest military power. However, while I was playing SW2, Tadakatsu Honda quoted

"The enemy has outnumbered us greatly. They have taken the high ground and have surrounded us in a crane formation."

But during the battle, didn't that Kobayakawa guy join the East, leaving the West pretty much defenseless? (As in he had lots of troops and access through the south.)

Although, Iyeasu was patient. He waited for the right time to strike, which was right after Hideyoshi's death, kind of a jerk move. So I would join the West and support them as much as possible.

[yellow turban]

"The enemy has outnumbered us greatly. They have taken the high ground and have surrounded us in a crane formation."

But during the battle, didn't that Kobayakawa guy join the East, leaving the West pretty much defenseless? (As in he had lots of troops and access through the south.)

1.I think that the numbers were even (80.000 VS 80.000)
2.Yes,he did so

[Mitsurugi]

Although, Iyeasu was patient. He waited for the right time to strike, which was right after Hideyoshi's death, kind of a jerk move. So I would join the West and support them as much as possible.

i don't think of that as a jerk move how is it that its a jerk move when he was given an opportunity although i really do not like Iyeasu i can say he was wise to make such a move

[looknohands]

1. Blame Hideyoshi for killing a perfectly viable heir in Hidetsugu after the birth of Hideyori.
2. Blame Mitsunari for a. being among those that disliked Hidetsugu and favored his removal, and b. for provoking battle with Ieyasu, setting the stage for a battle between those "loyal" to the Toyotomi and those "loyal" to Ieyasu.

Don't blame Ieyasu for taking advantage of the situation presented to him, considering his loyalty to Hideyoshi was always enforced by might, not respect.

[Mitsurugi]

see looknohands knows what i am talking about

[champion undivided]

i will join the outnumbered ones! am looking for a good fight!!!!

[Dragon Master]

I have respect for both the Eastern and Western Armies.  I guess the better motivated army (Eastern) won in the end.  Ieyasu Tokugawa fought for everything he got.  It seems like he always had the deck stacked against him but he would always persevere in the end.

Ieyasu Tokugawa started off life hard as a prisoner for the Imagawa when he was younger.  He broke free and eventually started his own clan.  Several years later, after building his army, Shingen Takeda decimates  Ieyasu's army at the battle of Mikatagahara.  Ieyasu Tokugawa barely escapes with his life.  However, he learned from the battle and rebuilt his army to eventually seize power from the Hojo.  He would later go on to Sekighahara and own the day.  Basically, Ieyasu was a made man and his soldiers respected him for this.

Now lets take a look at Mitsunari Ishida.  He grew up under the protection of his father Masatsugu Ishida in Omi Province.  Mitsunari knew Hideyoshi Hashiba (Toyotomi) from his younger days while growing up.  This gave Mitsunari the ability to cement his relationship with the Toyotomi.  Mitsunari Ishida got a sweet job as a Finance Minister for Hideyoshi when he turned of age.  

Mitsunari was basically a bureaucrat.  Later, on in his life, after Hideyoshi Toyotomi dies, Mitusnari Ishida decides to become a 'Samurai' and catapults himself to power forming the Western Army by utilizing his family influence.  At the same time, he inherits powerful warriors from the Oda, Shimazu, Tachibana, Ukita, and Mori clans.

By far Mitsunari Ishida's life was a walk in the park compared to Tokugawa Ieyasu. Mitsunari should of 'owned' Japan.  He had all the pieces set up to win.  However, his arrogance and overconfidence cost him the battle at Sekigahara and his own life.

[Dragon Master]

Well even though the West had some very peace loving states, most of them had the littlest military power. However, while I was playing SW2, Tadakatsu Honda quoted

"The enemy has outnumbered us greatly. They have taken the high ground and have surrounded us in a crane formation."

But during the battle, didn't that Kobayakawa guy join the East, leaving the West pretty much defenseless? (As in he had lots of troops and access through the south.)

Although, Iyeasu was patient. He waited for the right time to strike, which was right after Hideyoshi's death, kind of a jerk move. So I would join the West and support them as much as possible.

Yes.  Hideaki Kobayakawa defected during the battle leaving Mitsunari's flank open.  This action caused panic and devastated the morale of the Western army leading to their loss.

[TauCommander]

Mitsunari started the fight. He spoke ill of Ieyasu to Toshie but didn't work out as he planned. Then he tried to assasinate Ieaysu but still he was spared.
Soon he started to plot to bring down the Tokugawa. He kidnapped daimyos wives and expect them to follow him. Moreover he made enemies out of other fellows of Toyotomi. Disgraceful!!!

Ieyasu was securing the Tokugawa clan with his political and diplomatic skills. Mitsunari jumped in without proper plan and led his people to a genocide. The whole westerners paid the price by following this 'snake'.

Don't blame Ieyasu for this war.  By the way, only he is caple of bringing peace to the land after Hideyoshi. The Toyotomi supporters were very fragile in their support (not all). The Korean War just proved there's no peace once the was united. War is still going on and death toll is rising (when Hideyoshi was alive). If Mitsunari wins will they obey him or Hideyori who's a peasant descendant. Will there be peace or will Mitsunari continue the war. No leaders or whatsoever.
Ieyasu is the answer for them.

[Mitsurugi]

Well Ieyasu clearly won that confrontation by remaining united with his army

[The White Horse General]

You can't really blame the entirety of the loss on Mitsunari really, I highly doubt it whatsoever that he even planned to lead the West during that battle in fact... the main leader of the Western Army wasn't there, that was Terumoto Mori, let's also not forget Hiroie Kikkawa or however you spell it, defecting to the east, therefore stalling most of the Morichika Chosokabe's forces, among a few others.

Then there was Hideaki to the southwest of Mitsunari's main camp, whereas he was hesitant and he himself took no side in the fighting, his generals did, they rushed the prepared, yet illmanned flank which was protected by Yoshitsugu Otani, and he even went so far as to push them back up the hill, but sadly, 4,000 or so men against like 15,000 give or take, that's quite a number to be matched up against.

Won't lie though, I'm kinda a fan of the West, they never sought to take over, they showed no intentions of removing Hideyori, and from the looks of it, to keep the Toyotomi around. However, this is my view on the entire situation.