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[jschult5]

Yep.

[Metalman24]

well guys I've observed 2 things from this bowl season.

1.TCU is officially better than Boise. I mean come on, they were able to beat what was in my opinion a Wisconsin who I thought was extremely good. TCU's defense was excellent, and I tip my hat to those guys, that's a solid win, and a win I don't think Boise would be able to get.

2. The Big Ten is more like the Big Fail. 2 blowouts, a loss to a pretty crappy Florida team, a loss to Texas Tech, and then the Rose Bowl loss on top of that. I've always said Big Ten football was weak but come on:Nothing? And I'm honestly expecting Ohio St to lose to Arkansas. It's just been a rough one for the Big Ten.

I'm looking forward to more great bowl games and am expecting Oklahoma to continue to dominate tonight. Oh, and ROLL TIDE!!!! 49-7!

[jschult5]

well guys I've observed 2 things from this bowl season.

1.TCU is officially better than Boise. I mean come on, they were able to beat what was in my opinion a Wisconsin who I thought was extremely good. TCU's defense was excellent, and I tip my hat to those guys, that's a solid win, and a win I don't think Boise would be able to get.

2. The Big Ten is more like the Big Fail. 2 blowouts, a loss to a pretty crappy Florida team, a loss to Texas Tech, and then the Rose Bowl loss on top of that. I've always said Big Ten football was weak but come on:Nothing? And I'm honestly expecting Ohio St to lose to Arkansas. It's just been a rough one for the Big Ten.

I'm looking forward to more great bowl games and am expecting Oklahoma to continue to dominate tonight. Oh, and ROLL TIDE!!!! 49-7!

 

So let me get this straight... TCU is better than Boise because they beat a team that wasn't Boise from a 'weak' conference?  That is plain stupid.  And that's another thing:

Ticketcity Bowl is in Dallas, Texas which is 300 miles from TT and 900 from NW

Capital One Bowl is in Orlando, FL which is 550 miles from Alabama and 1200 miles from Michigan State

Outback Bowl is in Tampa, FL which is 133 miles from Gainesville, FL and 1100 miles from State College, PA

Progressive Gator Bowl is in Jacksonville, FL which is 600 miles from Miss St and 1000 from Mich

Rose Bowl is in Pasedena which is 1200 miles from TCU and 2050 from Wisconsin

Not to mention Illinois playing Baylor in the TEXAS Bowl!  I mean come on!  The temperatures up in the north have been around 15-30 for the month leading up to these games and these games take place in temperatures around 50-60 degrees.  Then they get shipped out across the country and are expected to play the best football of their lives?

Also, doesn't it bother you how the SEC is catered to in all these games?  Probably not because you are the one being catered to, but let's see... we also have Tennessee playing in a bowl game... in Tennessee- and NC probably bused through Knoxville on their way to Nashville  .  South Carolina played FSU in Hotlanta which was again closer to SC.  Moreover, Arkansas plays Ohio State in Louisiana?  Remind me which is closer?  HMMMMM!  The ONLY games that the SEC plays in where they have to travel farther than their opponent are the title game and LSU vs Texas A&M.  That's IT!  Seven of the nine games are on their home turf.

My point: stop making stupid generalizations based on exhibition games.  You cannot 'prove' anything until the southern and western teams grows some balls and play a game up in some adversity.  Remember all the problems LSU had last year crying about field conditions and how it was raining?  Of course you don't, you only hear what you want to hear.  Nevermind that both teams are playing on the same field!

Then again, the minute they do grow some balls and decide to play up north, they will have their balls shoot up into their chest!    Seriously though, let's try to start thinking about these things a little more logically. 

[Metalman24]

Youre saying they lost....because of location? Excuses! If the Big Ten is so high and mighty, shouldn't they win? Or at least put up a fight? But, you just hate on the SEC, and if that's what you wanna do? Fine. But the day the Big Ten is better then the SEC, is the day I say they are, and that will never happen, because they never will be, and it's proven pretty much every season.

Northerners brag about "it's so cold here, southern teams could never win." Come down here in August when it's 90+ out there! Play a game then! Put your work in the summer when it's 100 degrees! Then see how tough you are. I know this part of work is irrelevant, but God, people who spit that bullcrap piss me off! It's insulting to me when you call people from where I live weak because it's not cold here!
 
Boise would lose to TCU. But it is only an opinion.

[jschult5]

Youre saying they lost....because of location? Excuses!

No, I am arguing your point of view.   If you want to talk about how the Big 10 is a weak conference because of 1 game half the teams have, then you should have that one game be in a truly neutral location.  Judging a conference based on a handful of games is stupid.  Allow me to refer you to this again:

My point: stop making stupid generalizations based on exhibition games.

Moving on.  I'm going to refer to different points here because you are all over the place.

If the Big Ten is so high and mighty, shouldn't they win? Or at least put up a fight? But, you just hate on the SEC, and if that's what you wanna do? Fine.

...

Northerners brag about "it's so cold here, southern teams could never win." Come down here in August when it's 90+ out there! Play a game then! Put your work in the summer when it's 100 degrees! Then see how tough you are. I know this part of work is irrelevant, but God, people who spit that bullcrap piss me off! It's insulting to me when you call people from where I live weak because it's not cold here!

Please quote me where I lied about the SEC?  Where did I say the Big 10 was great?  I can give you a whole list of reasons why the Big 10 teams lost and most of it comes down to bad coaching- Mich, Wisconsin- and/or lack of production and execution- Penn State, Mich State, Mich, and NW.  But again, talking about the entire conference because of a handful of games is ridiculous, especially when the game takes the teams so far away- they aren't meeting somewhere in the middle, it almost always favors the other team whether they are in the Big 12, SEC, or Pac 12.

And apparently you have a short memory!  Did Penn State not go down to Alabama for the second game of the year this year?  Didn't Ohio State go down to Texas a couple years back at the beginning of the season?  But will Alabama and did Texas come in the winter?  No.  And just so you know, the football season generally doesn't start in August. 

Oh and by the way, who said this: "it's so cold here, southern teams could never win."?  It certainly wasn't me.  It isn't that they could never win, some teams- like Florida State and Miami- have to go up and play Maryland and some other northern teams.  But you won't find any SEC teams in their ranks.  The 2001 Miami team that went undefeated and rolled over everyone had their lowest point total, 18, in Boston in mid November and their second lowest, 26, up in Virginia in early December.  And this was a team that was scoring 60+ points on ranked opponents at home!  There is something to say for having to deal with adversity.  That something cannot be said for the SEC.

But the day the Big Ten is better then the SEC, is the day I say they are, and that will never happen, because they never will be, and it's proven pretty much every season.

That's pretentious.

Boise would lose to TCU. But it is only an opinion.

Yes, it is an opinion and not an observation as suggested here:

well guys I've observed 2 things from this bowl season.

1.TCU is officially better than Boise. I mean come on, they were able to beat what was in my opinion a Wisconsin who I thought was extremely good. TCU's defense was excellent, and I tip my hat to those guys, that's a solid win, and a win I don't think Boise would be able to get.

 

[Metalman24]

No, I am arguing your point of view.  If you want to talk about how the Big 10 is a weak conference because of 1 game half the teams have, then you should have that one game be in a truly neutral location.  Judging a conference based on a handful of games is stupid.  

They got ouplayed and outcoached. No home crowd couldve salvaged that. I fail to see how that is stupid? Can you not tell what they have to offer in that amount of games? Or is that just me here?

The second point. When did I say you lied about the SEC? I said you don't like them.That's all. And you never sung the praises of the Big Ten, but defending them was bull man. It was nothing but a road game anyway. And you are going to critcise me for judging a handful of teams while you basically judge all southern teams based off of 2 teams being Miami and Florida St.?  

Nobody said southern teams couldn't win, but it's the general attitude people have. And it pisses me off.

Man I just gotta ask, what you got against southern football?

My comment was Pretentious? Very well.

And yes, poor choice of words was a result of the TCU thing.

[jschult5]

They got ouplayed and outcoached. No home crowd couldve salvaged that. I fail to see how that is stupid? Can you not tell what they have to offer in that amount of games? Or is that just me here?

OK, well you edited your post while I was replying and it made my browser crash for some reason... I guess?  Anyway, the first paragraph was:

"Teams are faced with adversity. Big Ten just so happened to fall flat in that adversity. And I fail to see how that is stupid? Can you not tell what they have to offer in that amount of games? Or is that just me here?"

To which I was going to respond: it is stupid because you are judging them with skew information.  What a wonderful world it would be if you could know everything from one side of the story.

As a response to your edit:  Nope!  They weren't necessarily outplayed.  Penn State would have won handily had the quarterback not thrown 5 interceptions.  Penn State was dominating Florida running the ball and on defense.  Florida did outplay PSU on special teams though.  

Wisconsin and Northwestern weren't out coached either.  It was simply bad coaching.  I don't recall seeing Wisconsin blitz once; they just let one of the most accurate passers in the game sit in the pocket and pick them apart.  A strategy which may have worked in a place like Wisconsin where the temp was in the teens, but not in Pasadena where it is sunny and 60.  They also held back their Doak Walker finalist... ie, not smart.  NW's coach simply didn't get his team focused for kick off, NW could obviously hang with Texas Tech.

Mich and Mich State were probably out coached and out played, but that is typical if you know anything about either of those teams as of late.  But I honestly don't know because I didn't watch those games.

Anyway, home crowd is irrelevant- and I have no idea where it came from.  Taking a team used to one environment and putting them in another is always a factor, why do you think they make a big deal about Mile High stadium in the pros?  The team with less to adapt to will more often then not have to deal with less adversity.  Why did Wisconsin and TCU have to play in a stadium where the temp was 10 degrees warmer than TCU's home and 40 warmer than Wisconsin's?  Now they need to play a game in Maine where the temp is 10 degrees colder than Wisconsin and 40 colder than Texas.  If TCU wins that, then I would actually be interested.

The second point. When did I say you lied about the SEC? I said you don't like them.That's all.

Well since I did not lie and was still somehow hating on them, we have that you can dish it out but you cannot take it.  Oh, and I like the some SEC teams- I am actually a Florida fan.  Moreover, I've liked Urban Meyer since he was at BGSU- I live 20 minutes from there.  However, I do not like that everyone kisses their butts and ASSUMES they are the best.  Moreover, somehow they are inherently faster than everyone else.  That's complete nonsense.

And you never sung the praises of the Big Ten, but defending them was bull man. It was nothing but a road game anyway. And you are going to critcise me for judging a handful of teams while you basically judge all southern teams based off of 2 teams being Miami and Florida St.?

Right defending the Big 10 was bull, just like you defending the SEC is bull.  Again, you can dish it out, but you cannot take it!  All I want to see is the SEC come on the road that time of year!  Come on!  It's just a road game!

Yes!  I am going to criticize you while I give you concrete evidence against what you are saying!  I didn't just pick any southern team!  I picked two southern teams that were exemplary at one time and during those times I gave evidence of my point.  That is more than you have done!

[jschult5]

Nobody said southern teams couldn't win, but it's the general attitude people have. And it pisses me off.

Nobody said it, but everyone thinks it?  Uh huh... are you sure you aren't projecting just a little?  Maybe there's a little doubt in the back of your mind?

Man I just gotta ask, what you got against southern football?

People respect the attitude of: We'll take on anyone, anywhere, anytime.  SEC football appears to be: We'll take on anyone, who comes to us, when the weather is moderately good.  YAWN!  I can't wait for ICEE to sponsor a bowl up in Minnesota!  I mean seriously, the Ice Bowl would have been another championship without the weather!

My comment was Pretentious? Very well.

Not a compliment.

And yes, poor choice of words was a result of the TCU thing.

Yep.

[BlackFalcon]

In response to posts above:

O.o

Um... Texas Tech won, so yay...?

And I don't get the value in a conference being stronger than another conference in terms of bragging rights. Whoopty do...

[Metalman24]

Jschult, yes they were outplayed! In football you wanna know how you lose? You get outplayed, whether the game is won by a small margin or if they're beating you to death. What you saw was Florida wanting the game and outplaying Penn St!

And ok, in the world I come from, if your coaching good or bad, and the other guys is coaching better than you, you're getting outcoached. Hence the NW and Wisconsin losses.

Well, neutral crowd as you were hoping for, home crowd was a late night dandy. Weather doesn't neccessarily affect the outcome of the game! If TCU played in that game you described, I'd still take em after what I saw on Saturday! And I'd take anyone who beat Big Ten teams down here in the south in a colder game!

Moving right along, Jscult has it ever crossed your mind that these people say the SEC is the best for a reason? We've dominated the past 5 years. Jus sayin.

Moving along to the point about the road game thingy. I hope the SEC does this. Did I care before?no, but to shut you up about this I hope we do and we dominate whoever it is, although I obviously have no control over what they will do.

Next stop, on how you said I was projecting. Hey, I got no doubts at all man.

Last point where I asked you what you have against southern ball. Again, I hope they do go up north. But I got no control over anything now do I?

[jschult5]

Jschult, yes they were outplayed! In football you wanna know how you lose? You get outplayed, whether the game is won by a small margin or if they're beating you to death. What you saw was Florida wanting the game and outplaying Penn St!

And ok, in the world I come from, if your coaching good or bad, and the other guys is coaching better than you, you're getting outcoached. Hence the NW and Wisconsin losses.

Well you live in a world of absolutism then don't you?  I should have known.  So back when Utah beat the crap out of Alabama, were they outplayed or outcoached?  It must have been pretty bad for you to have someone from the high and mighty SEC beaten by a NAQ school.  And yet no one went around like an a&#!ole badmouthing them.

In response to posts above:

O.o

Um... Texas Tech won, so yay...?

And I don't get the value in a conference being stronger than another conference in terms of bragging rights. Whoopty do...

For me it has nothing to do with which conference is better.  If I had to pick a conference that was the strongest this year I would say either the Pac10 or the SEC.  But I wouldn't judge either one simply by five or six games either one plays.  That would be stupid, and yet Mr. Metal seems to think it is a good idea.

Well, neutral crowd as you were hoping for, home crowd was a late night dandy. Weather doesn't neccessarily affect the outcome of the game! If TCU played in that game you described, I'd still take em after what I saw on Saturday! And I'd take anyone who beat Big Ten teams down here in the south in a colder game!

And yet we will never know.  You can take them, but that means nothing.

Moving right along, Jscult has it ever crossed your mind that these people say the SEC is the best for a reason? We've dominated the past 5 years. Jus sayin.

If they actually waited until one game was played and said that the SEC was the best, then I would have more respect for them.  But some- like yourself it would seem- just assume that they are before one game is played.  Not that one game means anything anyway!

Moving along to the point about the road game thingy. I hope the SEC does this. Did I care before?no, but to shut you up about this I hope we do and we dominate whoever it is, although I obviously have no control over what they will do.

Boy, you really don't understand.  I grew up in Ohio, I moved to Atlanta and then to California before coming back to Ohio.  Someone who thinks they can just move from one area to another and expect to win doesn't have very much perspective I am guessing.

Next stop, on how you said I was projecting. Hey, I got no doubts at all man.

Last point where I asked you what you have against southern ball. Again, I hope they do go up north. But I got no control over anything now do I?

Are you sure?

But you might want to think twice about talking smack until they do.  That's just ignorance.

[Metalman24]

Well i guess i do! The Alabama loss was a combination of both. Utah defintitely outplayed us, and we didn't make the right offensive calls, and that game was a total disaster. 

And yes, I guess I think something stupid is reasonable.

We may not know who would win, but I really doubt it would make a difference in the outcome.

I go by what I see, I go by what I see in the bowl
games, what I see from upcoming players throughout the season, and I go by who's leaving. And many people like myself see the SEC on top of things. Sorry!

Ok, I'm not gonna lie, I've never lived north of Atlanta, and I'm currently in southern Alabama, so you could say I have no idea. But I still think the coaching and talent of our players would win the games for us!


Moving on, yes, I'm complety sure, and if I think I'm gonna be right, I'm gonna say it. Call that ignorance if you like.

[rag-time4]

I am also looking forward to watching SMU, when they get in a rhythym they're fun to watch. June Jones has done a great job getting that program to a respectable status again, and I expected nothing less.

As you wish Jschult.

Disappointed to see SMU lose their game... their defense played fantastic throughout, really limiting the Army's triple option offense. The announcers picked up on something that I hadn't really picked up on in the two or three games I had seen SMU play this season: their offense lacks big-play makers, making their version of the Run and Shoot attack largely a ball control offense, which the Run and Shoot is not known for.

To me it goes to show that a lot of what is said about the Run and Shoot as an offensive scheme is simply not true, such as the oft-repeated claim that Run and Shoot teams are at a disadvantage in terms of time of possession because they are not good at ball control and will either score too fast or not run enough time off the clock before surrendering possession.

Anyway, good to see SMU at least make a game of it after having an absolutely dreadful start to the game and falling behind big early on. Looking forward to next season. I may invest in the ESPN gameplan package to watch them every week.

[jschult5]

Well i guess i do! The Alabama loss was a combination of both. Utah defintitely outplayed us, and we didn't make the right offensive calls, and that game was a total disaster.  

Yeah, they got their butts handed to them in every aspect of the game.  Roll Tide!

And yes, I guess I think something stupid is reasonable.

Doesn't say a whole lot for yourself.

We may not know who would win, but I really doubt it would make a difference in the outcome.

Considering LSU's reaction to last year's loss, I would say that there is evidence against you.

I go by what I see, I go by what I see in the bowl
games, what I see from upcoming players throughout the season, and I go by who's leaving. And many people like myself see the SEC on top of things. Sorry!

OH!  Let's have some fun!  I submit to you that the Big 10 was weaker than the SEC this year.  But the SEC was weaker than many other conferences:
Tennessee lost to North Carolina and South Carolina lost to Florida State... so the SEC is weaker than the ACC.  Georgia lost to Central Florida... so the SEC is weaker than Conference USA as well.  Since all the non-SEC above are fairly young and talented... the SEC is looking pretty bad.

Your logic not mine.

Ok, I'm not gonna lie, I've never lived north of Atlanta, and I'm currently in southern Alabama, so you could say I have no idea. But I still think the coaching and talent of our players would win the games for us!

You have no idea.

Moving on, yes, I'm complety sure, and if I think I'm gonna be right, I'm gonna say it. Call that ignorance if you like.

Being completely sure without reason is equivalent to ignorance because it stands against what education tries to instill.

Disappointed to see SMU lose their game... their defense played fantastic throughout, really limiting the Army's triple option offense. The announcers picked up on something that I hadn't really picked up on in the two or three games I had seen SMU play this season: their offense lacks big-play makers, making their version of the Run and Shoot attack largely a ball control offense, which the Run and Shoot is not known for.

To me it goes to show that a lot of what is said about the Run and Shoot as an offensive scheme is simply not true, such as the oft-repeated claim that Run and Shoot teams are at a disadvantage in terms of time of possession because they are not good at ball control and will either score too fast or not run enough time off the clock before surrendering possession.

Anyway, good to see SMU at least make a game of it after having an absolutely dreadful start to the game and falling behind big early on. Looking forward to next season. I may invest in the ESPN gameplan package to watch them every week.

You may not need to invest any money directly; you can watch many games on ESPN 3 now.  It is free and every game I've tried to view was on it- except maybe those exclusive to the Big 10 network, but SMU doesn't fall in that category.  However, if you want to watch it on a big screen, you may have to  invest in some cables to hook up your computer to the TV.

[Metalman24]

But did I deny that? What point does that prove? Keep in mind almost that entire team was back and won the title next season.

But it is reasonable! If your team doesn't show up in the bowl game, how does that reflect on your team? These games are HUGE for a lot of schools! You don't think Michigan St had something to prove? Rich Rod in the Michigan game basically was coaching for his job! These games are the best way to judge teams because you see what each is made of!

But, I suppose it does cut both ways, doesn't it?

Well I think what I think,and in this case I have a lot of faith that these teams would win, and if that makes me ignorant to you, then so be it.


Ragtime, I was very disappointed with SMU. They didn't show up offensively whatsoever, and June Jones really needs to get away from the running game a little bit. I believe they'd have more success if they'd throw it around a lot more.